I understood the daily rest time was 11 hours. I have just started working for a delivery company that like one to complete deliveries no matter what. Any problems with the truck (cost me 2 hours last Mon)… so what - get deliveries completed (finished 2130)!
i.e. one starts at 0600 and can work until 2000 or 2100. If one is starting at 0600 then one has to be back at depot (truck unloaded, parked, paperwork completed and exiting company security) at 1900. One can extend by 2 hours up until 2100 - twice a week or three times over a fortnight (11 hours rest extended to 9). Not sure how one can work 15 hours per day for 3 consecutive days which is what someone told me once.
The appropriate thing to do if late back is then to take the rest period and start work the following day at a later time. Hmm… with this firm all that would happen is you would still get the same delivery quantity the following day and be back late again. Apart from looking for another job is there a solution. All I can think of is one needs to be aware of time to get back to the yard (inc unloading, paperwork etc) and fail the last few deliveries on a day if necessary.
A little bit of confusion going on in that post. The daily rest is 11 hours but can be reduced to 9 hours 3 times a week. In both cases the rest must be contained within the 24 hour period from the start of work.
Driving is 9 hours a day and can be extended to 10 hours twice a week.
Whilst that may help clear up the confusion, you are still left with the issue of not completing the work in the shift. If the work isn’t possible to complete, the company is wrong to expect it to be done. But if it can be reasonably completed, maybe the issue is in working a bit faster. That comes with practice and I’m not referring so much to the driving as the speed in unloading and completing documentation as required. And that does get quicker.
If the work really cant be done, then the only option really is to get back in time to complete your shift allowing enough time for the daily rest - whether normal or reduced.
It’s possible to expand on the drivers’ hours further, but I think that’s enough to clear up the query.
jessejazza:
One can extend by 2 hours up until 2100 - twice a week or three times over a fortnight (11 hours rest extended to 9). Not sure how one can work 15 hours per day for 3 consecutive days which is what someone told me once.
Whoever told you that is a numpty on regs knowledge
Daily rest can be reduced from 11 hours to as little as 9 hours a maximum of 3 times between any two weekly rests - not per week
I know that; just considered it best to keep the answer simple as there is enough confusion! I did mention that it would be possible to expand on the answer in my defence!
When you say that 90% of the industry is running illegally, its not surprising given the total lack of understanding that “underpins” the concept of the Drivers Hours Rules 2006 - ie 561/2006. That concept is the Fixed week which is clearly defined as Monday-Sunday. (I have left the times out!)
That is the FIXED week and is the only Week that is defined in the Regs as a WEEK per se. It is defined at article 4(i).
There is no doubt that the Regs are poorly written but at Article 1(13) it clearly allows for a driver to start a new, in effect “working” week on any day of the week. This allows Days Off (Weekly Rest) to be taken anywhere in the Week. If this was not the case then everybody would be weekend off, every weekend!
Thus reductions in Daily Rest can be taken between said Weekly Rest periods but not more than 3 Times.
It may be easier if the period between Weekly Rest periods was described as the “Working Week” - as it often is in Enforcement Circles - and the Working Week and Fixed week do not need to be aligned.
“Driving Time”( 9 or 10 hours, 56 hours and 90 hours) are all “FIXED WEEK” activities and “Daily Rest Reductions” are a “working week” activity.
jessejazza:
One can extend by 2 hours up until 2100 - twice a week or three times over a fortnight (11 hours rest extended to 9). Not sure how one can work 15 hours per day for 3 consecutive days which is what someone told me once.
Whoever told you that is a numpty on regs knowledge
It was actually a transport manager of a large company… I was having an interview for a Class 1 indemnity scheme (shortly after I got Class 2). Firm up the road from me also makes folk do 15 hour days or sacks individuals.
Thanks for your replies. I’m not confused on daily rest time - just think of it in terms of hours one can work in a day.
This past week I’ve done 2 nights over 13 hours and another 2 over 14. Not excluding the issue of working breaks (very common in Class 2 jobs I have found). On the evening I was back after 2200 I was told by the office to complete deliveries. Looking at the run sheet what they in fact do is to time each job and distance covered, and then work you until 1900 (with no allowance for completing paperwork and clearing up). So any delays are the driver’s fault - no allowance for traffic or customer delays.
So end of 2nd week and I’ve got more infringements than I’d like to admit (so have others but just keep quiet). One can make an anonymous intelligence report to DVSA but I don’t think I’ll be lasting long.
jessejazza:
Thanks for your replies. I’m not confused on daily rest time - just think of it in terms of hours one can work in a day.
This past week I’ve done 2 nights over 13 hours and another 2 over 14. Not excluding the issue of working breaks (very common in Class 2 jobs I have found). On the evening I was back after 2200 I was told by the office to complete deliveries. Looking at the run sheet what they in fact do is to time each job and distance covered, and then work you until 1900 (with no allowance for completing paperwork and clearing up). So any delays are the driver’s fault - no allowance for traffic or customer delays.
So end of 2nd week and I’ve got more infringements than I’d like to admit (so have others but just keep quiet). One can make an anonymous intelligence report to DVSA but I don’t think I’ll be lasting long.
Sad but true, in a lot of multi drop jobs you have to work your breaks, sorting out the back of the truck, to get the job done. It’s an unwritten rule that it’s expected of you. How else are you expected to get 40+ drops done in the hours? That’s why I hate multi drop with a passion, and I’m not alone in that.
ROG:
So why have you chosen to break the daily rest laws by doing more than 3 reduced daily rests between weekly rests
Hardly much choice! I phoned in to warn on time and was told by a women what my options were!!! She didn’t even know about daily rest.
But you should know the regulations and be prepared to say what time you need to be finished by, if you deliberately ignore the regulations because of people who don’t know the job you’re going to have big problems eventually.
This past week I’ve done 2 nights over 13 hours and another 2 over 14.
So end of 2nd week and I’ve got more infringements…
So why have you chosen to break the daily rest laws by doing more than 3 reduced daily rests between weekly rests
Hardly much choice! I phoned in to warn on time and was told by a women what my options were!!! She didn’t even know about daily rest.
There is one very clear choice. You return to base before your hours are up. That women in the office won’t be paying your fines for insufficient rest. You’re being taken for a mug and you’re letting them do it.
ROG:
So why have you chosen to break the daily rest laws by doing more than 3 reduced daily rests between weekly rests
Hardly much choice! I phoned in to warn on time and was told by a women what my options were!!! She didn’t even know about daily rest.
But you should know the regulations and be prepared to say what time you need to be finished by, if you deliberately ignore the regulations because of people who don’t know the job you’re going to have big problems eventually.
This ^ and the post before and after. Keep an eye on your hours and make sure you are parked up at the allotted time, be it in a lay-by or at base. Don’t go over, vosa will not accept the excuses (unless it’s exceptional circumstances) getting the job done ain’t one of them. If hours are running out, take it back. I’ve done it a few times. The flak you get off the gaffer is nothing against the possible fine/ban you could be looking at.
You CHOSE to break the law - you said you knew what the law is so that is a fact
If office told you to break the law then how far would you go ?
Bit silly but would you go as far as killing someone !
There has to come a point where you say NO I WILL NOT DO THAT BECAUSE IT IS ILLEGAL
There is a problem with scumbag firms taking advantage of newly passed drivers. “Working breaks”, what tosh?! No such thing as a 'working break", its a oxymoron.
However, at the end of the day it is your card and you do as you see fit. If you want to play by the rules then thats what you do. If you want to tip on break so you can get home on Friday, you can do that too but in turn you risk the fine if you get caught. The likelihood of that happening? Slim but you don’t know who’s watching.
