I know that Self Employed are exempt from the WTD untill 2009 and that self employed under the WTD is slightly different from the Tax Mans view. If you run 1 truck as a limited company would you still be exempt because you actually work for that company as a director.
Just a thought because I’m thinking of going down this road myself and unsure wether to go LTD or not.
Many thanks
Yes, as far as I know you would be. I asked this question a while ago and somebody posted a reply with the information, can’t remember who or where it was though.
Thanks, it was starting to confuse me a bit. Afew of the O/Ds down the Grain will be a bit happier now as well.
Thanks again
Are you positive as I thought that being an employee (managing director on paye) meant you are included in the parameters for the introduction next year!?
I’ve held off becoming ltd for this very reason.
As far as I recall yes. Something to do with the fact a Director needs extra time for administrative tasks etc.
You might well be right Neil, but for tax purposes the director of a ltd company is an employee of the company, I just asked my missus she reckons that and is an aat accountant. Id go sole trader myself, its a sure way of avoiding the wtd till 09.
I agree with you Mal about the tax thing but for the WTD it looks like they may be OK.
Remember nothing is really finalised with the WTD and even the one about OD’s needing more than one customer looks like it is being changed. They are now saying as long as you don’t have a contract with one customer, and who the hell has contracts these days as an OD, then you will be counted as being exempt because you are free to work for anyione else at a moments notice.
It just a matter of waiting and seeing.
I found this accredited to Croner’s, not exactly definitive, but worth pondering.
How are the self-employed defined?
The self-employed are defined as those: whose main occupation is to transport passengers or goods by road for hire or reward with the appropriate licences; who are entitled to work for themselves and who are not tied to an employer by an employment contract or by any other type of working hierarchical relationship; who are free to organise the relevant working activities; whose income depends directly on the profits made; and who have the freedom to, individually or through a cooperation between self-employed drivers, have commercial relations with several customers. For the purposes of this Directive, those drivers who do not satisfy these criteria are subject to the same obligations and benefit from the same rights as those provided by the current Directive for workers.
I read that as meaning that whether LTD or Sole Trader makes no difference.
that was the thing I read Ken. And it says you must have the freedom to have more than one customer should you wish, it doesn’t say you must have more than one customer
who have the freedom to, individually or through a cooperation between self-employed drivers, have commercial relations with several customers
Also where it mentions ‘with the appropriate licences’ that would be an O Licence and a sole trader would have it in their name but a company director wouldn’t and I think that may be where some of the confusion is coming from. I think that if it is a one man band who happens to be a limited company then they will not come under the WTD.
if it is a one man band who happens to be a limited company then they will not come under the WTD.
That’s the way I read it as well. Do other European Countries have LTD Companies as well, or something on the same lines or is that just a British way? If not, I believe that it would just mean sole-traders.
Other countries have the same sort of thing as a limited company.
Krankee:
or by any other type of working hierarchical relationship
Oh dont forget this bit even if you dont have a written contract there must be some sort of “hierarchial relationship” to show your position held within the company’s structure 
north surrey haulage:
you do not work for yourself but for the limited company as an employee & you will have an employment contract because it is what you use to set out your wage and bonus (share dividends) with
Sorry, but I can’t see someone registered as a Ltd Co having an employment contract. It would be more like a financial projection where a higher wage is taken in the ‘fatter’ months and less in the ‘leaner’ months.
Surely the ultimate test would be:- Are you entitled to Holiday Pay? Can you be dismissed? If you were dismissed, 
do you have recourse for Wrongful Dismissal? 
Surely if the answer to ANY of those questions is NO, then you are NOT an employee and can claim exemption until 2009.
Krankee:
north surrey haulage:
you do not work for yourself but for the limited company as an employee & you will have an employment contract because it is what you use to set out your wage and bonus (share dividends) with
Sorry, but I can’t see someone registered as a Ltd Co having an employment contract. It would be more like a financial projection where a higher wage is taken in the ‘fatter’ months and less in the ‘leaner’ months.
Surely the ultimate test would be:- Are you entitled to Holiday Pay? Can you be dismissed? If you were dismissed,
Surely if the answer to ANY of those questions is NO, then you are NOT an employee and can claim exemption until 2009.
Well if there was more than one drector then yes you could be sacked (by the other directors voting you out)
As an employee then yes you would be entitled to holiday pay
so I guess you wont come under the remit for the exemtion
I’m glad we cleared that up 
north surrey haulage:
Krankee:
or by any other type of working hierarchical relationship
Oh dont forget this bit even if you dont have a written contract there must be some sort of “hierarchial relationship” to show your position held within the company’s structure
Ooops that went a bit ■■■■ up and I lost the earlier post i wrote but I think you still get the drift 
must be the time of day 
and what happens to owner drivers post 2009?
Excellent point Robinhood 
Well, after 09 its sposed to be in with the rest under the wtd aint it? But the way its going the rudder seems to have tumbled off the ship, anything might happen far as I can see.
Last thing I read on it they will asses it and if there hasn’t been any detrimental effect on things like road safety and competition the exemption could continue past 2009. Things are still changing all the time so again nothing is definite.
Very interesting that both Sky and BBC News are full of reports this morning of hospitals having to close wards because of the WTD for Doctors. coming into force today. They said many hospitals will have to work illegally just to maintain the levels of service they have now.
I wonder if our industry will get the same coverage when the WTD hits, maybe with stories of how prices will rise because of the extra cost for transport.