Double manned vehicle and daily rest

I’ve just started a new job doing days as part of a double manned crew. I’ve looked at the RHA guide I’ve got and all it says is that drivers must have a minimum of 9hrs within a 30hr period. Does that mean that I no longer need to take an 11hr rest period?

Thanks in advance

It can do, a good double man team can cover some miles.

Both of you have 9 hours together

I could be wrong but I thought that fairly recently the EU stated that the 9 hours taken within a 30 hour shift by a double manned crew counts as a reduced daily rest which is max 3 between weekly rests

Rest periods cannot be taken in a moving vehicle

This is the post on the gov.uk website last updated beginning of October.

A 9-hour daily rest must be taken within a period of 30 hours that starts from the end of the last daily or weekly rest period. For the first hour of multi-manning, the presence of another driver is optional, but for the remaining time is compulsory.

ROG:
I could be wrong but I thought that fairly recently the EU stated that the 9 hours taken within a 30 hour shift by a double manned crew counts as a reduced daily rest which is max 3 between weekly rests

Rest periods cannot be taken in a moving vehicle

That’s my understanding and around 75% of our work is double-manned (though we rarely max those hours anyway).

madmackem:
For the first hour of multi-manning, the presence of another driver is optional, but for the remaining time is compulsory.

Admittedly I don’t double man but I’ve never really understood the logic behind this. If the second driver wasn’t picked up until four hours into the first driver’s shift, then so long as the rest period is determined by the first driver’s start time, then why would it matter?

Found it under the DVSA bit on the gov.uk website

Organising drivers’ duties in such a fashion enables a crew’s duties to be spread over 21 hours however where a driver utilises the multi-manning daily rest concession (of 9 hours rest in a 30 hour period) that rest period cannot be counted as a regular daily rest as it is of less than 11 hours duration. These rest periods therefore count towards the limit of 3 reduced rest periods between any 2 consecutive weekly rest period.

So I do need to take at least one 11hrs rest period.

what sort of runs use up all of the available hours to the max, we used to run double manned on adr in Europe and as well as music tours but not every usable hour, I do not recall having to worry about hours, days sometimes if loading, shipping or holidays got in the way.

madmackem:
Found it under the DVSA bit on the gov.uk website

Organising drivers’ duties in such a fashion enables a crew’s duties to be spread over 21 hours however where a driver utilises the multi-manning daily rest concession (of 9 hours rest in a 30 hour period) that rest period cannot be counted as a regular daily rest as it is of less than 11 hours duration. These rest periods therefore count towards the limit of 3 reduced rest periods between any 2 consecutive weekly rest period.

So I do need to take at least one 11hrs rest period.

Depends on how many daily rests you are taking and if 3 of them are reduced ones

hotel magnum:
what sort of runs use up all of the available hours to the max, we used to run double manned on adr in Europe and as well as music tours but not every usable hour, I do not recall having to worry about hours, days sometimes if loading, shipping or holidays got in the way.

This summer our biggest drive was Rome to Barcelona in one complete shift. 19 hours, 1360Km. Music tour work does use all the hours you can get. If the 21 hours is there for the taking, we’ll use it.

ROG:

madmackem:
Found it under the DVSA bit on the gov.uk website

Organising drivers’ duties in such a fashion enables a crew’s duties to be spread over 21 hours however where a driver utilises the multi-manning daily rest concession (of 9 hours rest in a 30 hour period) that rest period cannot be counted as a regular daily rest as it is of less than 11 hours duration. These rest periods therefore count towards the limit of 3 reduced rest periods between any 2 consecutive weekly rest period.

So I do need to take at least one 11hrs rest period.

Depends on how many daily rests you are taking and if 3 of them are reduced ones

Rog,

Monday to Friday. Looks like it is 3 reduced each week, so it will be one full 11hr needed unless I get a split break in somewhere.

hotel magnum:
what sort of runs use up all of the available hours to the max, we used to run double manned on adr in Europe and as well as music tours but not every usable hour, I do not recall having to worry about hours, days sometimes if loading, shipping or holidays got in the way.

I know most of the F1 teams were double manning some of their trucks when the races were on concurrent weekends.

madmackem:

hotel magnum:
what sort of runs use up all of the available hours to the max, we used to run double manned on adr in Europe and as well as music tours but not every usable hour, I do not recall having to worry about hours, days sometimes if loading, shipping or holidays got in the way.

I know most of the F1 teams were double manning some of their trucks when the races were on concurrent weekends.

F1 trucks are nearly always double manned regardless of what race it is.

Pretty much motorsport/tour stuff is double manned a lot. You can get far in 20 hours driving, only stopping for fuel and changeovers.

La jonquera > to the midlands can be done if the conditions are good. Thats a lot of miles.

madmackem:
I’ve just started a new job doing days as part of a double manned crew. I’ve looked at the RHA guide I’ve got and all it says is that drivers must have a minimum of 9hrs within a 30hr period. Does that mean that I no longer need to take an 11hr rest period?

Thanks in advance

You are correct in my opinion as EU Tacho Regs 561/2006 say so.

Article 8 paragraph 2 states

“Within each period of 24 hours after the end of the previous daily rest period or weekly rest period a driver shall have taken a new daily rest period.

If the portion of the daily rest period which falls within that 24 hour period is at least nine hours but less than 11 hours, then the daily rest period in question shall be regarded as a reduced daily rest period”.

However paragraph 5 states

“By way of derogation from paragraph 2, within 30 hours of the end of a daily or weekly rest period, a driver engaged in multi-manning must have taken a new daily rest period of at least nine hours.”

Thus there is no such thing as regular or reduced rests when multimanning as they are described in paragraph 2 which does not apply to multimanning.

Harry Monk:

madmackem:
For the first hour of multi-manning, the presence of another driver is optional, but for the remaining time is compulsory.

Admittedly I don’t double man but I’ve never really understood the logic behind this. If the second driver wasn’t picked up until four hours into the first driver’s shift, then so long as the rest period is determined by the first driver’s start time, then why would it matter?

I guess there is some clever reason for it but hell if I can figure it out either Harry.

Hurryup&wait:

madmackem:
I’ve just started a new job doing days as part of a double manned crew. I’ve looked at the RHA guide I’ve got and all it says is that drivers must have a minimum of 9hrs within a 30hr period. Does that mean that I no longer need to take an 11hr rest period?

Thanks in advance

You are correct in my opinion as EU Tacho Regs 561/2006 say so.

Article 8 paragraph 2 states

“Within each period of 24 hours after the end of the previous daily rest period or weekly rest period a driver shall have taken a new daily rest period.

If the portion of the daily rest period which falls within that 24 hour period is at least nine hours but less than 11 hours, then the daily rest period in question shall be regarded as a reduced daily rest period”.

However paragraph 5 states

“By way of derogation from paragraph 2, within 30 hours of the end of a daily or weekly rest period, a driver engaged in multi-manning must have taken a new daily rest period of at least nine hours.”

Thus there is no such thing as regular or reduced rests when multimanning as they are described in paragraph 2 which does not apply to multimanning.

Harry Monk:

madmackem:
For the first hour of multi-manning, the presence of another driver is optional, but for the remaining time is compulsory.

Admittedly I don’t double man but I’ve never really understood the logic behind this. If the second driver wasn’t picked up until four hours into the first driver’s shift, then so long as the rest period is determined by the first driver’s start time, then why would it matter?

I guess there is some clever reason for it but hell if I can figure it out either Harry.

I rang dvsa helpline yesterday and they stated that you must take an 11hr rest period (normal mon-fri working week).

Is funny, the guy in the office said I didn’t need to take an 11hr rest period because I was home every night. :open_mouth:

madmackem:

Hurryup&wait:

madmackem:
I’ve just started a new job doing days as part of a double manned crew. I’ve looked at the RHA guide I’ve got and all it says is that drivers must have a minimum of 9hrs within a 30hr period. Does that mean that I no longer need to take an 11hr rest period?

Thanks in advance

You are correct in my opinion as EU Tacho Regs 561/2006 say so.

Article 8 paragraph 2 states

“Within each period of 24 hours after the end of the previous daily rest period or weekly rest period a driver shall have taken a new daily rest period.

If the portion of the daily rest period which falls within that 24 hour period is at least nine hours but less than 11 hours, then the daily rest period in question shall be regarded as a reduced daily rest period”.

However paragraph 5 states

“By way of derogation from paragraph 2, within 30 hours of the end of a daily or weekly rest period, a driver engaged in multi-manning must have taken a new daily rest period of at least nine hours.”

Thus there is no such thing as regular or reduced rests when multimanning as they are described in paragraph 2 which does not apply to multimanning.

Harry Monk:

madmackem:
For the first hour of multi-manning, the presence of another driver is optional, but for the remaining time is compulsory.

Admittedly I don’t double man but I’ve never really understood the logic behind this. If the second driver wasn’t picked up until four hours into the first driver’s shift, then so long as the rest period is determined by the first driver’s start time, then why would it matter?

I guess there is some clever reason for it but hell if I can figure it out either Harry.

I rang dvsa helpline yesterday and they stated that you must take an 11hr rest period (normal mon-fri working week).

Is funny, the guy in the office said I didn’t need to take an 11hr rest period because I was home every night. :open_mouth:

Wonder If the “guy in the office” would put that in writing of that’s what he wants you to do?

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