Load position

So, yesterday, I had the “pleasure” of losing 8 hours of my life… Sorry, I’ll rephrase that… Yesterday, I was on a CPC refresher course.
(read that as 8 hours snooze)

During the course however, the ‘instructor’ did a bit on loadings and one of his questions led to a real argument; I’m interested to see what you lot think.

Scenario:-
You have a single deck curtain-sider.
You are collecting 40 euro pallets at 700kg each.
The forkies have put 16 down each side of the bed of the trailer.

Question:- Where do you get them to load the rest?

On the grounds that he was ‘going around the room’, and came to me first, I said that I’d start just forward of the front wheels on the trailer and work forward. Basically, I’d put them over where the under-run bars are.
The other Class 1 drivers on the course (there were 8 Class 1s) all agreed to a degree. One of the blokes said he’d put them slightly further back and another one said he’d start over the middle axle of the trailer but all the drivers essentially agreed that they would be around there somewhere.

Then the arguments started.

The ‘instructor’ stated that we were all wrong and that the load should go at the front against the headboard - and work back.

We all argued that that would increase your axle loadings etc but the ‘instructor’ claimed that the load would be more secure because it couldn’t shift under braking and therefore it was more stable.

Our comments of “If that’s the case, I’ll strap it to within an inch of it’s life!” got us nowhere; the instructor basically said “I’m the instructor and I’m right.” (I, politely, DIDN’T point out that I’ve been driving [zb] lorries since before his daddy even got the [zb] erection!)

So… Where would YOU put them?

Win-Stone:
So, yesterday, I had the “pleasure” of losing 8 hours of my life… Sorry, I’ll rephrase that… Yesterday, I was on a CPC refresher course.
(read that as 8 hours snooze)

During the course however, the ‘instructor’ did a bit on loadings and one of his questions led to a real argument; I’m interested to see what you lot think.

Scenario:-
You have a single deck curtain-sider.
You are collecting 40 euro pallets at 700kg each.
The forkies have put 16 down each side of the bed of the trailer.

Question:- Where do you get them to load the rest?

On the grounds that he was ‘going around the room’, and came to me first, I said that I’d start just forward of the front wheels on the trailer and work forward. Basically, I’d put them over where the under-run bars are.
The other Class 1 drivers on the course (there were 8 Class 1s) all agreed to a degree. One of the blokes said he’d put them slightly further back and another one said he’d start over the middle axle of the trailer but all the drivers essentially agreed that they would be around there somewhere.

Then the arguments started.

The ‘instructor’ stated that we were all wrong and that the load should go at the front against the headboard - and work back.

We all argued that that would increase your axle loadings etc but the ‘instructor’ claimed that the load would be more secure because it couldn’t shift under braking and therefore it was more stable.

Our comments of “If that’s the case, I’ll strap it to within an inch of it’s life!” got us nowhere; the instructor basically said “I’m the instructor and I’m right.” (I, politely, DIDN’T point out that I’ve been driving [zb] lorries since before his daddy even got the [zb] erection!)

So… Where would YOU put them?

He is right, assuming that doing so does not overload any of the tractor unit axles. If it does, then he is wrong. And it’s impossible to know whether the axles would be overloaded without knowing the position of the fifth wheel, pin depth, trailer axle positions, empty trailer weight etc.

Over the trailer axles.

Sapper

33 on the deck, then the other 7 over the back wheels,on top.

Then weigh it.

Win-Stone:
So, yesterday, I had the “pleasure” of losing 8 hours of my life… Sorry, I’ll rephrase that… Yesterday, I was on a CPC refresher course.
(read that as 8 hours snooze)

During the course however, the ‘instructor’ did a bit on loadings and one of his questions led to a real argument; I’m interested to see what you lot think.

Scenario:-
You have a single deck curtain-sider.
You are collecting 40 euro pallets at 700kg each.
The forkies have put 16 down each side of the bed of the trailer.

Question:- Where do you get them to load the rest?

On the grounds that he was ‘going around the room’, and came to me first, I said that I’d start just forward of the front wheels on the trailer and work forward. Basically, I’d put them over where the under-run bars are.
The other Class 1 drivers on the course (there were 8 Class 1s) all agreed to a degree. One of the blokes said he’d put them slightly further back and another one said he’d start over the middle axle of the trailer but all the drivers essentially agreed that they would be around there somewhere.

Then the arguments started.

The ‘instructor’ stated that we were all wrong and that the load should go at the front against the headboard - and work back.

We all argued that that would increase your axle loadings etc but the ‘instructor’ claimed that the load would be more secure because it couldn’t shift under braking and therefore it was more stable.

Our comments of “If that’s the case, I’ll strap it to within an inch of it’s life!” got us nowhere; the instructor basically said “I’m the instructor and I’m right.” (I, politely, DIDN’T point out that I’ve been driving [zb] lorries since before his daddy even got the [zb] erection!)

So… Where would YOU put them?

Don’t get the question.The forkies have ‘already’ put 32 pallets on ?.Where were they all put front to rear to start with ?.As for me I’d go with the idea of start from the headboard first to help load security then work back regardless and then check out the gross and the axle weights at the end preferably using the nearest weigh bridge or on board scales.Which obviously includes the 32 pallets ? already on there.Which by those figures is a 28t payload :open_mouth:.Although I’m assuming it’s a 6 axle 44 tonner in which case it has to tare at no more than 16t which is pushing it with a 3 axle unit ?. Although having said that my maths is zb. :laughing:

We regularly carry 51 euro pallets of paper and this is how we have always done it. 33 on deck and 18 on top starting from the middle axle of the trailer and working forwards and then plenty of straps. I’ve been pulled by VOSA with it loaded like this and nothing was said about it being wrong and I’ve never had them fall over due to braking. If we were to load it as he said we would certainly overload the front axles

We load euros on a fridge 3 across the bed.
Start at the headboard to the back 23.? Ton 33 pallets
Front to back equal weight over 6 axels not a problem at the end of the day it’s a solid mass don’t mater which way
In yourcase I would have loaded
32 pall on the bed 8 on top over the trailer axels depending on the type of curtain trailer depends on the restraints used.

I’d start loading the extra pallets over the middle trailer axle, if the pallets were at all dodgy I’d stand a couple of pallets on their sides in front and cross strap them to stop the load moving or falling forward.

Sent from my mobile.

40 x 700kgs = 28,000kgs.
So, it is a full load on a 16,000kgs unladen outfit with a triaxle trailer and a triaxle unit. 26t gross unit and 24t on trl axles?
Assuming pin, fifth wheel and axle positioning are all optimal to distribute the weight evenly:
fully evenly loaded there would be 3t underload at both unit and trl bogie?
So the bed load (32plts 22t400) will give an extra underload of (28t00-22t400 halved) 2t800 at tractor and trl bogie. So 5t400 “spare”.
Loading the 8 x 700kg plts at the head board would increase the weight on the unit by about 5t600.

There are problems with the calcs Ive done there*, but the outfit may well be legally overweight on the front. What does this fictitious trailer plate say max imposed load through pin I wonder? It may not have the load shift under braking, but would be IMHO very unstable in the bends. I would as Win-Stone says put them pretty much in the middle. The instructor is looking at only one aspect to the problem. Wouldnt fancy having to drop a trailer with that much weight on the neck either!

*I`ve made assumptions and taken shortcuts regarding unladen weights etc.

I’m loaded with a load of scaffold poles for Monday. 24t.

Loaded as many as I can on the bed and then evenly spread the others between middle of unit rear axle and second axle of trailer.

So pretty much the same.

Sent from my SM-G903F using Tapatalk

Franglais:
40 x 700kgs = 28,000kgs.
So, it is a full load on a 16,000kgs unladen outfit with a triaxle trailer and a triaxle unit. 26t gross unit and 24t on trl axles?
Assuming pin, fifth wheel and axle positioning are all optimal to distribute the weight evenly:
fully evenly loaded there would be 3t underload at both unit and trl bogie?
So the bed load (32plts 22t400) will give an extra underload of (28t00-22t400 halved) 2t800 at tractor and trl bogie. So 5t400 “spare”.
Loading the 8 x 700kg plts at the head board would increase the weight on the unit by about 5t600.

There are problems with the calcs Ive done there*, but the outfit may well be legally overweight on the front. What does this fictitious trailer plate say max imposed load through pin I wonder? It may not have the load shift under braking, but would be IMHO very unstable in the bends. I would as Win-Stone says put them pretty much in the middle. The instructor is looking at only one aspect to the problem. Wouldnt fancy having to drop a trailer with that much weight on the neck either!

*I`ve made assumptions and taken shortcuts regarding unladen weights etc.

Realistically it’s an impossible question without knowing where/how the 32 pallets already loaded have been placed on the load bed.IE the idea of start from the headboard means that the front of the trailer and pin weight is already loaded to the max anyway ?. :confused: As for an unstable outfit a relatively light unit v a heavy trailer is worse than vice versa.

I do love a good old “debate” at driver cpc days.

I try to keep my mouth shut and just listen. Watching things getting heaten and arguments forming is good entertainment.

Id say the instructor is wrong though. You can strap things to stop them shifting forward, you cant change the axle weights you have to deal with.

When I started reading your post I imagined what I’d have said, and I imagine I’d have answered with an obvious ■■■■ take, flippantly saying “dunno mate, probably on the headboard”.

I was shocked to read your post further and realise that was his actual serious answer lol. It turns out I’d have inadvertently been his blue eyed boy if I’d said that :open_mouth:

I leave this sort of thing to the forklift driver.

sammym:
I leave this sort of thing to the forklift driver.

A forklift driver who has been loading trucks for twenty years may do a better job than you or I.
One who passed his forklift test yesterday…

Rob K:
He is right, assuming that doing so does not overload any of the tractor unit axles.

^ This.

sammym:
I leave this sort of thing to the forklift driver.

And I’m sure the spotty teenaged Ed Sheeran fan would be crying his eyes out with remorse and reaching for his wallet to compensate you if/when you got pulled by DVSA and got fined, and god help you if you had an accident or load loss out on the road, yeah blame the forkie, sure the DVSA, Police or TC would lap up that excuse… :unamused:

Don’t forget that you are the one who is responsible and held accountable for the load and its safe securing no one else.

Reef:

sammym:
I leave this sort of thing to the forklift driver.

And I’m sure the spotty teenaged Ed Sheeran fan would be crying his eyes out with remorse and reaching for his wallet to compensate you if/when you got pulled by DVSA and got fined, and god help you if you had an accident or load loss out on the road, yeah blame the forkie, sure the DVSA, Police or TC would lap up that excuse… :unamused:

Don’t forget that you are the one who is responsible and held accountable for the load and its safe securing no one else.

In the real world - when you turn up and the trailer is loaded do you really start checking the weight of each pallet? And then demanding that it’s redistributed etc… If it was clearly wrong I wouldn’t take it out. But I’m not losing sleep over small things.

I don’t want to be disrespectful - but I find in the real world things don’t work like this. Maybe trunking with a full load. But when you have 6 drops and they need to come off in an order the weight goes where the order needs to be rather than where it would be most perfect. I could turn up at each drop and have the forklift drivers reposition everything - but we all know I’d be told to jog on.

Reef:
you are the one who is responsible and held accountable for the load and its safe securing no one else.

I’m pretty sure the vendor does bare some legal responsibility.

sammym:

Reef:

sammym:
I leave this sort of thing to the forklift driver.

And I’m sure the spotty teenaged Ed Sheeran fan would be crying his eyes out with remorse and reaching for his wallet to compensate you if/when you got pulled by DVSA and got fined, and god help you if you had an accident or load loss out on the road, yeah blame the forkie, sure the DVSA, Police or TC would lap up that excuse… :unamused:

Don’t forget that you are the one who is responsible and held accountable for the load and its safe securing no one else.

In the real world - when you turn up and the trailer is loaded do you really start checking the weight of each pallet? And then demanding that it’s redistributed etc… If it was clearly wrong I wouldn’t take it out. But I’m not losing sleep over small things.

I don’t want to be disrespectful - but I find in the real world things don’t work like this. Maybe trunking with a full load. But when you have 6 drops and they need to come off in an order the weight goes where the order needs to be rather than where it would be most perfect. I could turn up at each drop and have the forklift drivers reposition everything - but we all know I’d be told to jog on.

If I’m not happy with it I WILL tell them to shift it about or it doesn’t move, but then I’m not afraid to stand up for myself, I’m sorry that you do not feel confident enough to stand up for yourself, maybe that’ll come with a few more years and experience under your belt.

To be brutally honest your attitude is exactly why H&S is now spoon fed to us all even the ones who can think and act for themselves.