Wtd rule clampdown, fact or bs

Just a friendly warning for those interested.
So take heed or do not …I aint really fussed. :smiley:

I’ve always said on here when the subject of wtd/poa and all that type of crap comes up, that I never bother with adhering to it.
Reason being I do not believe in it, …mainly because it’s ■■■■■■■■ in disguise as an official face saving excercise, to make it look on the surface that we are actually doing something, ie working sensible hours when in reality we are not…because of poa and all that ■■■■■■■■.

If I get infringements I either refuse to sign or I’ll sign with an explanation on the bottom similar to the above, such as…
‘‘When 48 hours max is actually compulsory, I will recognise this’’
… followed by the lad in the office grinning and shaking his head. :smiley:

However, I’ve just been told that after a meeting between our lot and DVSA, it was stated that there is about to be a clampdown on rule enforcement with fines for such as going over the 6 hours rule. :bulb:

Now before anyone jumps in, I aint dumb enough for one second to take everything at face value in this job (learned that one a loonnnngg time ago :bulb: ) and I’m fully aware it may be a ploy to make me take all this crap seriously at last, so make your own minds up.

It’s just a cautionary friendly heads up, to mark the cards of those who are as arsey about all this crap as much as me. :laughing:

(Those who do whatever tf they are told at all costs, just disregard this post, it does not apply to you… :smiley: )

I’m surprised they’ve never enforced it as I thought it’ll be another money making exercise for them, at our place about half the infringements are for wtd.

This comes as no surprise as there a self funding body it was only a matter of time and to be fair the only bit I dont agree with is the 48 hr average the 6 hour rule is required

I haven’t heard or seen anything about the DVSA starting to enforce the WTD, and I can’t find anything on their website so I’m a bit sceptical about it … but you never know.

bull.jpg

Like I said chaps, it probably is b/s as a ruse to get me to comply, but I’m keeping an open mind. :wink:

And I suppose tbf, it aint any hardship to take an extra 15 min break if not done before 6.

We’ve been told the same…even to the extent that if you are close to or over the 48hr average the company will stand us down to lower our average…unpaid of course!

We’ve been told that WTD is going to be in the crosshairs soon too.

DonutUK:
We’ve been told the same…even to the extent that if you are close to or over the 48hr average the company will stand us down to lower our average…unpaid of course!

My ‘infringements’ have always been going over the 6 hours.
Showing my ignorance here :blush: , and bring on the stick :smiley: , … but how the hell can you manage to average 48 hours if you are away tramping every week, I’m booking just less than 55 to 60 hours,.and I know for a fact others are exceeding 70.

I’ve never been interested enough to even bother to look all this crap up, but ‘‘IF’’ we are going to get hit in the pocket for it, I should maybe prepare to get my act together just in case. :neutral_face:

So…if anybody has a basic and easy idiot’s guide to it (well more like a guy forced into an interest’ s guide :smiley: ) let me know, but be warned …I get bored easy with this type of stuff. :smiley:

We’ve been doing the 6hour rule, since it started, but we’re paid card in to card out, as for the 48hr week, just put it on break, if it’s 48hrs duty, looks like need a pay rise to cover the lost 20hrs a week.

robroy:
My ‘infringements’ have always been going over the 6 hours.
Showing my ignorance here :blush: , and bring on the stick :smiley: , … but how the hell can you manage to average 48 hours if you are away tramping every week, I’m booking just less than 55 to 60 hours,.and I know for a fact others are exceeding 70.

It’s an average of 48 hours working time so maybe they’ve booking lots of breaks or dare I say it … poa :smiley:
Neither breaks nor POA count towards working time so can be used to keep the average down.

robroy:
I’ve never been interested enough to even bother to look all this crap up, but ‘‘IF’’ we are going to get hit in the pocket for it, I should maybe prepare to get my act together just in case. :neutral_face:

So…if anybody has a basic and easy idiot’s guide to it (well more like a guy forced into an interest’ s guide :smiley: ) let me know, but be warned …I get bored easy with this type of stuff. :smiley:

Here’s a post by muckles with a sort of cheat sheet for all the regulations including the WTD.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=134561&p=2111048

Here’s a post I did some time a to explain the wtd break requirements.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=138841&p=2182159

robroy:

DonutUK:
We’ve been told the same…even to the extent that if you are close to or over the 48hr average the company will stand us down to lower our average…unpaid of course!

My ‘infringements’ have always been going over the 6 hours.
Showing my ignorance here :blush: , and bring on the stick :smiley: , … but how the hell can you manage to average 48 hours if you are away tramping every week, I’m booking just less than 55 to 60 hours,.and I know for a fact others are exceeding 70.

I’ve never been interested enough to even bother to look all this crap up, but ‘‘IF’’ we are going to get hit in the pocket for it, I should maybe prepare to get my act together just in case. :neutral_face:

So…if anybody has a basic and easy idiot’s guide to it (well more like a guy forced into an interest’ s guide :smiley: ) let me know, but be warned …I get bored easy with this type of stuff. :smiley:

The 48 hrs is only “working”…i.e. driving and other work…time spent on rest/break or POA does not count towards the 48 hrs average…hence why employers want you to use POA as much as possible. I steadfastly refuse to use POA…I just put it on break instead…does exactly the same thing as far as WTD is concerned.
We won’t talk about what mode the tacho is on when loading/tipping depending on how it suits me at the time!!! :smiling_imp:

Pretty certain that the Trucker TImer app keeps an eye on this…I know that 2 weeks ago it was not happy with me for something to do with a weekly WTD limit…

I’m quite good at making sure that I don’t go over the 6 hours…you only need a 15 minute break to reset it…so i just try and grab 15 when I can knowing that it gives me another 6 hrs to play with.

6 hr rule I’m fine with , 48 hrs ive been over for as long as I can remember and nothing has been mentioned to me about dvsa tightening up on it by company , in fact the only communication is we want more hours out of you , extra shift .
Nb did few years ago gets regular letters from company saying I must keep my wtd hours below 48 , but never achieved it ( didn’t try ) and think they gave up with it in end and letters stopped

robroy:
Just a friendly warning for those interested.
So take heed or do not …I aint really fussed. :smiley:

I’ve always said on here when the subject of wtd/poa and all that type of crap comes up, that I never bother with adhering to it.
Reason being I do not believe in it, …mainly because it’s ■■■■■■■■ in disguise as an official face saving excercise, to make it look on the surface that we are actually doing something, ie working sensible hours when in reality we are not…because of poa and all that ■■■■■■■■.

If I get infringements I either refuse to sign or I’ll sign with an explanation on the bottom similar to the above, such as…
‘‘When 48 hours max is actually compulsory, I will recognise this’’
… followed by the lad in the office grinning and shaking his head. :smiley:

However, I’ve just been told that after a meeting between our lot and DVSA, it was stated that there is about to be a clampdown on rule enforcement with fines for such as pgoing over the 6 hours rule. :bulb:

Now before anyone jumps in, I aint dumb enough for one second to take everything at face value in this job (learned that one a loonnnngg time ago :bulb: ) and I’m fully aware it may be a ploy to make me take all this crap seriously at last, so make your own minds up.

It’s just a cautionary friendly heads up, to mark the cards of those who are as arsey about all this crap as much as me. :laughing:

(Those who do whatever tf they are told at all costs, just disregard this post, it does not apply to you… :smiley: )

So its not a good thing to only work 48 hours a week and looking at some posts on here people are panicking
So take heed or not I ain’t fussed, and it’s just my opinion, and I do what I want.
You will work 9 and a half hours a day and sleep the rest just think you will get 25 quid for sleeping 15 hours a day who else would pay you for sleeping
The prospects are unlimited what you could do, now i do me own thing so I’m not telling you what to do.
The money should be good 48 multiple by 8 quid an hour

tachograph:

robroy:
My ‘infringements’ have always been going over the 6 hours.
Showing my ignorance here :blush: , and bring on the stick :smiley: , … but how the hell can you manage to average 48 hours if you are away tramping every week, I’m booking just less than 55 to 60 hours,.and I know for a fact others are exceeding 70.

It’s an average of 48 hours working time so maybe they’ve booking lots of breaks or dare I say it … poa :smiley:
Neither breaks nor POA count towards working time so can be used to keep the average down.

robroy:
I’ve never been interested enough to even bother to look all this crap up, but ‘‘IF’’ we are going to get hit in the pocket for it, I should maybe prepare to get my act together just in case. :neutral_face:

So…if anybody has a basic and easy idiot’s guide to it (well more like a guy forced into an interest’ s guide :smiley: ) let me know, but be warned …I get bored easy with this type of stuff. :smiley:

Here’s a post by muckles with a sort of cheat sheet for all the regulations including the WTD.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=134561&p=2111048

Here’s a post I did some time a to explain the wtd break requirements.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=138841&p=2182159

Thanks for that mate.
I reckon I’ll be ok then,.as I tend to put my tacho on break quite a lot.

robroy:

DonutUK:
We’ve been told the same…even to the extent that if you are close to or over the 48hr average the company will stand us down to lower our average…unpaid of course!

My ‘infringements’ have always been going over the 6 hours.
Showing my ignorance here :blush: , and bring on the stick :smiley: , … but how the hell can you manage to average 48 hours if you are away tramping every week, I’m booking just less than 55 to 60 hours,.and I know for a fact others are exceeding 70.

Very easily. I doubt all of that 60hrs a week is spent physically loading/unloading the vehicle, fuelling it up and driving. You’ve got your 45 minute breaks to take off so there’s 3.75hrs a week if you just do one a day for five days. Then there’s the time you’re sat waiting to load or tip. Ask goods in/despatch how long you’re going to be waiting to get on a bay, get loaded or to get tipped and there’s an amount of time you can sit there on PoA so turn up to Asda, hand in your paperwork, ask them how long they’re going to be and they say an hour there’s an hour of PoA you’ve got which doesn’t count. You’ve got 26 pallets on and you know from your vast experience of the place it’ll take at least an hour to tip, there’s another hour PoA which doesn’t count as working time.

Very very few drivers need to fiddle anything to keep below 48hrs average whilst doing a 60hr or even 70hr week. What they do have to do though is think a little and do the above.

DVSA sanctions list = gov.uk/government/uploads/s … policy.pdf
Any WTD ones on it :question:

ROG:
DVSA sanctions list = gov.uk/government/uploads/s … policy.pdf
Any WTD ones on it :question:

To be fair, if they’re only now talking about enforcing the WTD there’s no reason why the penalties would be in a document dated last November.

Sent from my mobile.

Tbf the 48hr average is actually quite hard to break especially when you have built up a reference period. So say you did do an odd week where you did actually physically work (drive and cross hammertime) 60hrs instead of say 45hrs as the average. That 15hrs extra would be divided across all reference periods (we use rolling 26 weeks) so your average would only go up by about 40 minutes to 45.40ish.

I guess the WTD doesn’t apply to ship crews?