Been offered job away from home Mon - Fri they want to pay my night out money as part of wages ?
Oyeah:
Been offered job away from home Mon - Fri they want to pay my night out money as part of wages ?
Oh yeah
Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
Oyeah:
Been offered job away from home Mon - Fri they want to pay my night out money as part of wages ?
Would you prefer it in buttons? [FACE WITH TEARS OF JOY]
Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk
Night out payment in not a wage or any part of it.
So their paying you £250 for a 60hr week and £200 for your night outs all tax able 
Night out money is separate and non taxable as it counts as a hardship payment
Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
tomo3607:
Night out money is separate and non taxable as it counts as a hardship paymentSent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
Only under a set amount is it non taxable
Oyeah:
Been offered job away from home Mon - Fri they want to pay my night out money as part of wages ?
Cheers for providing so much info regarding your query, please do thank you come again!
nick2008:
tomo3607:
Night out money is separate and non taxable as it counts as a hardship paymentSent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
Only under a set amount is it non taxable
Yeah up 34.90 in some cases
Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
Thanks for the replies guys.
To be clear been offered job Mon - Fri no set hours per week or day could be 8 hrs one day 15 the next, overtime paid if i have to work Saturday or Sunday, but guaranteed £680 per week before tax for Mon - Fri, some weeks might 45 hrs others 60.
I’m pretty sure the maximum non taxable payment is £26.20 per 24hrs.
We’ve just had an RHA email about it.
Copied and pasted:
HMRC change to overnight allowance (September 2016)
HMRC has said that, with effect from April 2017, two new requirements will be imposed on hauliers that pay up to the agreed RHA overnight allowance rate, currently £26.20.
- Hauliers will be required to get an agreement from HMRC to make this payment tax and National Insurance free
- Hauliers will also be required to carry out random checks with their drivers that expense is being incurred. The RHA advises members to get clarity in writing from their local office what those checks should be, to avoid putting themselves at risk.
A year ago, HMRC created confusion by incorrectly stating on the Gov.uk website that there would be a requirement for random checking from April 2016. It did so without consultation and, after considerable delay, removed the incorrect notice and verbally apologised. We are unaware of anything on Gov.uk at present.
HMRC has told us in writing that change is a legal requirement, something with which the RHA, on professional advice, strongly disagrees. In any case, the “change” on which HMRC is relying has yet to be ratified by Parliament (the Finance Bill 2016).
The RHA has argued forcefully to ministers over several years against this change to a system that has worked well and will be making one last representation. We are also strongly critical of the way HMRC has approached this issue.
To seek an agreement with HMRC, either go to your regular contact or: National Insurance Contributions and Employers Office, HM Revenue and Customs, BX9 1BX, United Kingdom Telephone: 0300 200 3200
The RHA argued a position of no change on the following grounds:
• We urged Treasury minister to review the legal advice from HMRC, on the grounds that it was wholly wrong and that there is no legal obstacle to continuing with the current arrangements. The decision is purely down to a desire within HMRC to change the rules.
• The RHA has provided evidence of expenditure and the current limit of £26.20 is not excessive.
• The change flies against the findings of the Office of Tax Simplification and the government’s objective of reducing the burden on business. Large members will see their costs rise by £100,000, in some cases much more.
• The change is unenforceable in practice and will disadvantage compliant hauliers in terms of cost and recruitment what is a very cost-sensitive industry. HMRC is already struggling adequately to enforce straightforward rules on driver status, which is disadvantaging compliant firms. This will make compliance worse.

• Recruitment of UK residents into the industry is likely to be undermined just as we are trying to address a shortage of lorry drivers and worries over resilience, especially following the Brexit vote.
• Hauliers may be more inclined to use agency drivers, not least those from abroad.
• The additional costs on UK firms will make them less competitive with foreign hauliers, at a
time when UK market share of international work is at an all-time low (12%) and foreign hauliers’ share of the domestic market has risen by almost 50% in two years, according to official statistics from the Department for Transport.
• In strengthening the position of foreign hauliers still further, HM Treasury will lose employment, fuel and other taxes and duty.
• HMRC and Treasury ministers have ignored all these arguments as we have resisted the imposition of change this year.
We have little to add at this stage but will keep members informed. Comments or feedback to
j.semple@rha.uk.net
And a more recent update form that. MARCH 2017
Overnight allowance update
HMRC remains insistent that, from April 2017, hauliers must carry out random sample checks that drivers are incurring expense, in order to make payments free of tax. In practice, that means checking receipts.
The RHA’s engagement with HMRC on this issue has been the most frustrating I have experienced with any arm of central government in my ten years as director of policy at the RHA. It has been characterised, over the past three years, by a refusal to respond in any way to the argument that we have put forward as to why what HMRC is now requiring is inappropriate and damaging red tape. We have also had serious errors – such as wholly wrong notice on gov.uk that this arrangement would start from April 2016, which remained on gov.uk for three months after we pointed out the error early last year. We have also had a string of contradictions. Ten days ago we were told by email that parking costs were included in the allowance. They are not.
Treasury minister Jane Ellison has refused to meet us, even when urged to do so over the past three months by the Department for Transport. (Separately, we are still waiting for a response from Ellison to our request for a meeting to discuss enforcing the UK National Minimum Wage on drivers of foreign hauliers.)
The new arrangements change the RHA/HMRC agreement for the driver allowance to cover personal expenses which has been in place for 26 years and is well understood in the industry. HMRC has simplified its guidance, which is reflected in our note below:
Sleeper Cab Allowances
The tax rules relating to sleeper cab allowances change at 6 April 2017 and from then onwards it is only possible to continue this allowance free of income tax and National Insurance if you have a ‘bespoke agreement’ (that is, bespoke to the road haulage industry) in place with HMRC:
- What is the sleeper cab allowance?
This is a round sum up to an agreed amount (currently £26.20 per night) which can be paid to a lorry driver who is away from his/ her normal base overnight and incurs an expense in view of this.
The allowance is deemed to cover the cost of an evening meal, breakfast, washing facilities and upkeep of bedding in the cab. Food purchased in the driver’s own time cannot be included, but food purchased, for example at a supermarket outlet at a motorway services during work (or elsewhere), can be included. We are still awaiting clarification regarding the cost of buying specialist bedding, fridge, microwave etc., where these are bought by the driver, and will update this note when we receive confirmation from HMRC. - How to obtain HMRC approval to pay this allowance tax free?
To pay the sleeper cab allowance tax free you need to obtain agreement from HMRC in the form of a bespoke agreement. To get such an agreement, you will are required to:
- get your drivers to retain receipts of the costs they have incurred when they are claiming the sleeper cab allowance and
- undertake a random check of those claims (see below).
It is not possible to enter into an agreement with HMRC for these payments to be tax free unless you have this process in place.
You can apply for a bespoke agreement by writing to HMRC at either your local office or:
National Insurance Contributions and Employers Office HM Revenue and Customs
BX9 1BX
In writing you will need to quote your employer tax reference and: - make clear you are seeking a bespoke agreement for the RHA sleeper cab allowance
- confirm that your employees are required to retain evidence of expenditure incurred, and
- that you will be undertaking a sample review of the evidence of expenditure in line with HMRC guidance (see below)
If you prefer you can apply on line to HMRC at this LINK.
Once you have an agreement with HMRC this should remain in place for a period of up to five years.
- What sampling review process do I need to adopt?
HMRC requires employers who are operating a ‘bespoke agreement’ to have a process in place for checking evidence of expenditure incurred by drivers. The system requires drivers to retain evidence of costs they incur in the form of receipts and for the employer to have a checking system in place. That checking process needs to include an examination of a minimum of 10% of claims (ie drivers) in each expenses period (normally one month) and that the employer will select drivers at random to ensure that it is not always the same individuals who are selected.
In reviewing expenses it is not a case of ensuring the £26.20 was incurred on any given day because HMRC accepts that taking one day with the next the £26.20 is a reasonable estimate of the costs a driver is likely to incur. The demonstrated expense must be broadly in line, however. What qualifies as broadly in line is not defined.
If a driver fails to provide adequate evidence when he/she is selected for review then you will need to advise the driver of their failure to provide evidence that they have incurred expense and carry out a subsequent review to see if they are now complying. For those drivers who subsequently fail to provide adequate evidence HMRC would expect them to no longer be eligible to receive the payment free of tax and National Insurance.
IMPORTANT NOTE:
One option that we believe is open to members is to use a recently-introduced £5 allowance for personal incidental expenditure, which is available to all employees away overnight and is intended to cover items such as mobile phone calls etc. No receipts are required. In this way, £5 can be deducted from whatever overnight allowance is paid (up to £26.20), in relation to the costs evidenced by receipts. So, if an employer pays an overnight allowance of £24, for example, the sum the driver would need to evidence as having spent on meals, washing and upkeep of bedding would be broadly in line with £19. We are aware of members who are taking this route and our view is that it is within HMRC rules. We are awaiting confirmation from HMRC.
The RHA regrets very much the imposition of this new rule, which we have resisted for four years and which we regard as wholly unnecessary. We have taken professional tax expert advice throughout, and that continues. Despite the strong opposition of the RHA, employers of all sizes across the industry and their drivers, HMRC describes these objections, to which it refuses to respond, as a “storm in a teacup”.

We will continue to oppose this ill-judged red tape and are considering next steps. Meanwhile, do feel free to write to your MP and to include this note, or to write directly to Jane Ellison, Financial Secretary to the Treasury, 1 Horse Guards Rd, Westminster, London SW1A 2HQ.
Jack Semple Director of Policy 22nd March 2017
34.90 if you stay in a hotel funnily enough, seem to get more for staying in a room rather than a tin can
Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
tomo3607:
34.90 if you stay in a hotel funnily enough, seem to get more for staying in a room rather than a tin canSent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
Prob because it’ll cost you about another £20 at least on top of that 34.90…For a hotel room…
Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
goshow:
And a more recent update form that. MARCH 2017Overnight allowance update
HMRC remains insistent that, from April 2017, hauliers must carry out random sample checks that drivers are incurring expense, in order to make payments free of tax. In practice, that means checking receipts.
The RHA’s engagement with HMRC on this issue has been the most frustrating I have experienced with any arm of central government in my ten years as director of policy at the RHA. It has been characterised, over the past three years, by a refusal to respond in any way to the argument that we have put forward as to why what HMRC is now requiring is inappropriate and damaging red tape. We have also had serious errors – such as wholly wrong notice on gov.uk that this arrangement would start from April 2016, which remained on gov.uk for three months after we pointed out the error early last year. We have also had a string of contradictions. Ten days ago we were told by email that parking costs were included in the allowance. They are not.
Treasury minister Jane Ellison has refused to meet us, even when urged to do so over the past three months by the Department for Transport. (Separately, we are still waiting for a response from Ellison to our request for a meeting to discuss enforcing the UK National Minimum Wage on drivers of foreign hauliers.)
The new arrangements change the RHA/HMRC agreement for the driver allowance to cover personal expenses which has been in place for 26 years and is well understood in the industry. HMRC has simplified its guidance, which is reflected in our note below:Sleeper Cab Allowances
The tax rules relating to sleeper cab allowances change at 6 April 2017 and from then onwards it is only possible to continue this allowance free of income tax and National Insurance if you have a ‘bespoke agreement’ (that is, bespoke to the road haulage industry) in place with HMRC:
- What is the sleeper cab allowance?
This is a round sum up to an agreed amount (currently £26.20 per night) which can be paid to a lorry driver who is away from his/ her normal base overnight and incurs an expense in view of this.
The allowance is deemed to cover the cost of an evening meal, breakfast, washing facilities and upkeep of bedding in the cab. Food purchased in the driver’s own time cannot be included, but food purchased, for example at a supermarket outlet at a motorway services during work (or elsewhere), can be included. We are still awaiting clarification regarding the cost of buying specialist bedding, fridge, microwave etc., where these are bought by the driver, and will update this note when we receive confirmation from HMRC.- How to obtain HMRC approval to pay this allowance tax free?
To pay the sleeper cab allowance tax free you need to obtain agreement from HMRC in the form of a bespoke agreement. To get such an agreement, you will are required to:
- get your drivers to retain receipts of the costs they have incurred when they are claiming the sleeper cab allowance and
- undertake a random check of those claims (see below).
It is not possible to enter into an agreement with HMRC for these payments to be tax free unless you have this process in place.
You can apply for a bespoke agreement by writing to HMRC at either your local office or:
National Insurance Contributions and Employers Office HM Revenue and Customs
BX9 1BX
In writing you will need to quote your employer tax reference and:- make clear you are seeking a bespoke agreement for the RHA sleeper cab allowance
- confirm that your employees are required to retain evidence of expenditure incurred, and
- that you will be undertaking a sample review of the evidence of expenditure in line with HMRC guidance (see below)
If you prefer you can apply on line to HMRC at this LINK.
Once you have an agreement with HMRC this should remain in place for a period of up to five years.
- What sampling review process do I need to adopt?
HMRC requires employers who are operating a ‘bespoke agreement’ to have a process in place for checking evidence of expenditure incurred by drivers. The system requires drivers to retain evidence of costs they incur in the form of receipts and for the employer to have a checking system in place. That checking process needs to include an examination of a minimum of 10% of claims (ie drivers) in each expenses period (normally one month) and that the employer will select drivers at random to ensure that it is not always the same individuals who are selected.
In reviewing expenses it is not a case of ensuring the £26.20 was incurred on any given day because HMRC accepts that taking one day with the next the £26.20 is a reasonable estimate of the costs a driver is likely to incur. The demonstrated expense must be broadly in line, however. What qualifies as broadly in line is not defined.
If a driver fails to provide adequate evidence when he/she is selected for review then you will need to advise the driver of their failure to provide evidence that they have incurred expense and carry out a subsequent review to see if they are now complying. For those drivers who subsequently fail to provide adequate evidence HMRC would expect them to no longer be eligible to receive the payment free of tax and National Insurance.IMPORTANT NOTE:
One option that we believe is open to members is to use a recently-introduced £5 allowance for personal incidental expenditure, which is available to all employees away overnight and is intended to cover items such as mobile phone calls etc. No receipts are required. In this way, £5 can be deducted from whatever overnight allowance is paid (up to £26.20), in relation to the costs evidenced by receipts. So, if an employer pays an overnight allowance of £24, for example, the sum the driver would need to evidence as having spent on meals, washing and upkeep of bedding would be broadly in line with £19. We are aware of members who are taking this route and our view is that it is within HMRC rules. We are awaiting confirmation from HMRC.
The RHA regrets very much the imposition of this new rule, which we have resisted for four years and which we regard as wholly unnecessary. We have taken professional tax expert advice throughout, and that continues. Despite the strong opposition of the RHA, employers of all sizes across the industry and their drivers, HMRC describes these objections, to which it refuses to respond, as a “storm in a teacup”.

We will continue to oppose this ill-judged red tape and are considering next steps. Meanwhile, do feel free to write to your MP and to include this note, or to write directly to Jane Ellison, Financial Secretary to the Treasury, 1 Horse Guards Rd, Westminster, London SW1A 2HQ.
Jack Semple Director of Policy 22nd March 2017
Clear as mud!
■■■■ the nights out I’ll drive home in my company pickup truck instead.